I got an info paper from my marriage counselor the other day, and it has info about how to be a better listener, how to have better communication in relationships. It's wonderful stuff, but I'm wondering if it is really something I should try to do within an emotionally abusive marriage. To me, it seems like these would be great skills to know and use in daily life and with dealing with others in general--and great for marriages where both partners have the intention of loving and respecting each other.
But in an emotionally abusive relationship, would following this make me more vulnerable to his "power over" kind of control and gaslighting behaviors?
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TEN ATTITUDES THAT PREVENT YOU FROM LISTENING
1. TRUTH. You believe that you are right and the other person is wrong. You are preoccupied with proving your point instead of expressing your angry feelings more directly or trying to grasp how the other person is thinking and feeling.
2. BLAME. You believe that the problem is the other person’s fault. You feel overwhelmingly convinced that you’re completely innocent and tell yourself that you have every right to blame him or her.
3. NEED TO BE A VICTIM. You feel sorry for yourself and think that other people are treating you unfairly because of their insensitivity and selfishness. Your stubborn unwillingness to do anything assertive to make the situation better gives people the impression that you like the role of martyr.
4. SELF-DECEPTION. You cannot imagine that you contribute to a problem because you cannot see the impact of your behavior on others. For example, you may complain that your wife nags you, but don’t think about the fact that you repeatedly “forgetâ€
What's your take on this? |
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What's your take on this?
by 
CreativeWoman on Sun 24 Feb, 2008 2:17 pm
Jesus replied, "Things that are impossible with people are possible with God." Luke 18:27
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CreativeWoman
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Go with your Gut!!!!!
by IleneW on Sun 24 Feb, 2008 5:16 pm
Hello CreativeWoman ----
At this moment, and probably for some time to come, pretty much everyone else out there, for one reason or another, doesn't quite get where survivors like us are at.
So when your gut, your feelings, your instincts are telling you what hurts and what isn't exactly right, listen to your gut, your feelings and your instincts.
I'm with you. I believe you were exactly right in what you concluded about those "Ten Attititudes." Exactly right!!!!
I don't even agree with all the items on the list. But most of them have some nuggets of usefullness----for couples who are not dealing with abuse!
As for the "neutral" position your father took. . . . . well, it appears noble on the face of it, though I've seen and heard similar things said in scenarios that weren't particularly supportive.
The thing is, when we begin learning about abuse and control, and we begin sharing what we've learned, there aren't a whole lot of places we can bring those insights.
HEAL circles and the HEAL message board are two places to bring your insights.
Thanks for writing!
Trust your instincts!!!
Ilene
At this moment, and probably for some time to come, pretty much everyone else out there, for one reason or another, doesn't quite get where survivors like us are at.
So when your gut, your feelings, your instincts are telling you what hurts and what isn't exactly right, listen to your gut, your feelings and your instincts.
I'm with you. I believe you were exactly right in what you concluded about those "Ten Attititudes." Exactly right!!!!
I don't even agree with all the items on the list. But most of them have some nuggets of usefullness----for couples who are not dealing with abuse!
As for the "neutral" position your father took. . . . . well, it appears noble on the face of it, though I've seen and heard similar things said in scenarios that weren't particularly supportive.
The thing is, when we begin learning about abuse and control, and we begin sharing what we've learned, there aren't a whole lot of places we can bring those insights.
HEAL circles and the HEAL message board are two places to bring your insights.
Thanks for writing!
Trust your instincts!!!
Ilene
Embrace non-violence.
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IleneW
- Care Circle Leader
- Posts: 1641
- Joined: Thu 19 Oct, 2006 12:16 pm
thanks for input
by CreativeWoman on Mon 25 Feb, 2008 9:17 am
Thank you for your input, ladies!
I really appreciate your validation here. You're right Ilene, that others just don't really comprehend what what kind of things go on with an emotional abuser, and why the advice they give can make things worse.
Jenny, I think you're right about my family of origin. As I began reading about verbal abuse in December (regarding my husband), I realized that my dad was verbally abusive as well. He grew up in an extremely critical family, where he was criticized for not being perfect. (how sad!) He was WAY better than his parents with us, but it definitely affected his personality and how he interacts with people. He's always been very affectionate, and very loving, there's no doubt that he loves me very much. His intentions were good--he wanted to show me the "right" way to do and think everything so that I could be spared the pain and heartache that he suffered as he made his way through life. He meant well, but that is SO not good for a growing child! It would have been far better if he validated me, and gave support as I tried out my own independence and learned from my own mistakes. I learned instead to doubt my abilities, my competence, and to not trust my own perceptions at times. Well, can't go back and change it, but recognizing that helps me understand how I became who I am.
My dad was (and is) controlling, strong-willed, and often thinks his way is the only "right" way. It can be annoying to be around that, that's for sure. He is also very caring, very generous, and loves to spend time with family, so there are lots of great things about him--he's not just a selfish man, he was affected by harsh treatment growing up and he was hurt. Although my mom is a very rugged, strong woman, she sort-of exemplified the wife who gave in and acted passive to get along with him. When we were growing up, my brother, sister, and I used to get fed up with the bickering and arguing that we continually heard...now I see that it was my dad being too controlling and my mom trying to stand up for herself. I guess she inadvertently learned that to make the house seem more peaceful she would just keep her mouth closed and not participate as much in the bickering with him. But what was really helpful about my mom was that she understood and sympathized with us (the 3 kids, individually) when my dad would say something hurtful...she was the "sympathetic witness" who validated our feelings. None of us knew until much later (including my mom) that what we were experiencing was in fact verbal abuse.
So I think this all did set me up to not really know what "normal" is. My husband's treatment has much more of an emotionally abusive component. He's very self-centered, gets jealous when others experience or have good things, he resents the inconveniences that naturally go along with having a wife and children, he's very critical of me as a PERSON if I make a slight mistake in something, and he's very quick to accuse me of anything--even things that are so completely not true.
He's very skilled at withholding affection and emotional support, and basically refuses to spend quality time alone with me...the exeption being 15 minutes/3 times a week to do a "daily marriage builders" book study he agreed to, and perhaps a date once every couple months. Other than that he spends his time at night watching TV, eating snacks, and basically doing anything without me. (he thinks that if I sit in the same room, watching his choice of TV shows when he watches, that is quality time! argh!) If I ask him to spend a few minutes alone with me on a certain day once in a while, he gets irritated and insists that I'm putting too much pressure on him and not respecting his need for "downtime." It's very lonely being his wife, and it's sad. There are so many stories I could tell, and perhaps I will bring them up on here little by little when I'm able...I guess maybe that would help me sort it out and perhaps others could relate as well...
Oh, I thought of one more thing...when my dad said that comment the other day about not automatically supporting me, he mentioned that my husband and I are both stubborn and self-centered (IMO, implying that we're both at fault somehow for his abuse). I remember being shocked at hearing him say that--as a CHILD I was self-centered as an immature kid. In growing up, I matured into a very compassionate, caring, loving person who just really is NOT very self-centered anymore. Why doesn't he see that?!!! As a Christian who started to really grow in my late teens and early 20's, I gave up the "old, childish ways" and the Lord has been steadily transforming my character into one more in line with His; the fruits of the spirit being gentleness, kindness, patience, self-control, etc...I was selfish and self-centered as a young kid, but I've grown, changed and matured for the better. People who know me--really know me--see that in me, and I do see it as well and I'm happy to know that life isn't "all about me." It did hurt a bit to hear my dad make that comment, and I don't think I'll be going to him for any kind of emotional support anymore about this stuff. His own wounds prevent him from really being able to give healing support to me.
Anyway, better go. Thanks again for the input here, and I hope that if anyone feels like sharing that you will.
I really appreciate your validation here. You're right Ilene, that others just don't really comprehend what what kind of things go on with an emotional abuser, and why the advice they give can make things worse.
Jenny, I think you're right about my family of origin. As I began reading about verbal abuse in December (regarding my husband), I realized that my dad was verbally abusive as well. He grew up in an extremely critical family, where he was criticized for not being perfect. (how sad!) He was WAY better than his parents with us, but it definitely affected his personality and how he interacts with people. He's always been very affectionate, and very loving, there's no doubt that he loves me very much. His intentions were good--he wanted to show me the "right" way to do and think everything so that I could be spared the pain and heartache that he suffered as he made his way through life. He meant well, but that is SO not good for a growing child! It would have been far better if he validated me, and gave support as I tried out my own independence and learned from my own mistakes. I learned instead to doubt my abilities, my competence, and to not trust my own perceptions at times. Well, can't go back and change it, but recognizing that helps me understand how I became who I am.
My dad was (and is) controlling, strong-willed, and often thinks his way is the only "right" way. It can be annoying to be around that, that's for sure. He is also very caring, very generous, and loves to spend time with family, so there are lots of great things about him--he's not just a selfish man, he was affected by harsh treatment growing up and he was hurt. Although my mom is a very rugged, strong woman, she sort-of exemplified the wife who gave in and acted passive to get along with him. When we were growing up, my brother, sister, and I used to get fed up with the bickering and arguing that we continually heard...now I see that it was my dad being too controlling and my mom trying to stand up for herself. I guess she inadvertently learned that to make the house seem more peaceful she would just keep her mouth closed and not participate as much in the bickering with him. But what was really helpful about my mom was that she understood and sympathized with us (the 3 kids, individually) when my dad would say something hurtful...she was the "sympathetic witness" who validated our feelings. None of us knew until much later (including my mom) that what we were experiencing was in fact verbal abuse.
So I think this all did set me up to not really know what "normal" is. My husband's treatment has much more of an emotionally abusive component. He's very self-centered, gets jealous when others experience or have good things, he resents the inconveniences that naturally go along with having a wife and children, he's very critical of me as a PERSON if I make a slight mistake in something, and he's very quick to accuse me of anything--even things that are so completely not true.
He's very skilled at withholding affection and emotional support, and basically refuses to spend quality time alone with me...the exeption being 15 minutes/3 times a week to do a "daily marriage builders" book study he agreed to, and perhaps a date once every couple months. Other than that he spends his time at night watching TV, eating snacks, and basically doing anything without me. (he thinks that if I sit in the same room, watching his choice of TV shows when he watches, that is quality time! argh!) If I ask him to spend a few minutes alone with me on a certain day once in a while, he gets irritated and insists that I'm putting too much pressure on him and not respecting his need for "downtime." It's very lonely being his wife, and it's sad. There are so many stories I could tell, and perhaps I will bring them up on here little by little when I'm able...I guess maybe that would help me sort it out and perhaps others could relate as well...
Oh, I thought of one more thing...when my dad said that comment the other day about not automatically supporting me, he mentioned that my husband and I are both stubborn and self-centered (IMO, implying that we're both at fault somehow for his abuse). I remember being shocked at hearing him say that--as a CHILD I was self-centered as an immature kid. In growing up, I matured into a very compassionate, caring, loving person who just really is NOT very self-centered anymore. Why doesn't he see that?!!! As a Christian who started to really grow in my late teens and early 20's, I gave up the "old, childish ways" and the Lord has been steadily transforming my character into one more in line with His; the fruits of the spirit being gentleness, kindness, patience, self-control, etc...I was selfish and self-centered as a young kid, but I've grown, changed and matured for the better. People who know me--really know me--see that in me, and I do see it as well and I'm happy to know that life isn't "all about me." It did hurt a bit to hear my dad make that comment, and I don't think I'll be going to him for any kind of emotional support anymore about this stuff. His own wounds prevent him from really being able to give healing support to me.
Anyway, better go. Thanks again for the input here, and I hope that if anyone feels like sharing that you will.
Jesus replied, "Things that are impossible with people are possible with God." Luke 18:27
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CreativeWoman
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Important Postings
by IleneW on Mon 25 Feb, 2008 5:51 pm
Hi CreativeWoman and Jenny ---
Wow. The original thread and Jenny's response makes for some worthwhile reading!
I'm going to pull a piece of it out for the Howl, in a little bit. Before I go there, I'd like to deal with one particular item, that's appeared on all the postings in this thread.
The fact that your father, CreativeWoman, insisted on taking a neutral position, was familiar to me. I only touched on it briefly, in my first response, and then Jenny came back in with a much stronger treatment. I was really glad she did. There were reasons why I didn't wade in right off the bat so I was happy that Jenny took the bull by the horns in a firmer way.
In my opinion, Jenny was absolutely right, that your father's not taking your side was passively abusive. On the face of it, it looks like your dad's just trying to be unbiased. That would seem like a good thing, and in some cases, it might be. Certainly, by claiming to be unbiased, your father presents the image of an impartial judge, a totally fair person. Controlling people often work very hard at presenting a supportive, compassionate front. And that's what it is: a front ---- a facade!
I had it happen to me, in a particular relationship. I was beginning a romantic partnership. Early on and then deeper in, this person insisted on remaining neutral, but then even subtley moving over to the side of a family member who was consistently abusive. In fact, further into the relationship, this person seemed to always take the side of whomever was opposing me! Talk about not being supportive!!!!
Thank you, Jenny, for picking up on that point and opening a dialogue around it.
And thank you, CreativeWoman, for taking time to talk about your story. Absolutely ---- we welcome any further tales you want to talk about. It's really a win/win. Writing about it will help you, and will also help others see that they're not out there dealing with uniquely bizarre behaviors. Most of the things any one of us might share would probably be echoed with only small variations, by thousands of others.
Please take care, be well and keep writing.
Ilene
Wow. The original thread and Jenny's response makes for some worthwhile reading!
I'm going to pull a piece of it out for the Howl, in a little bit. Before I go there, I'd like to deal with one particular item, that's appeared on all the postings in this thread.
The fact that your father, CreativeWoman, insisted on taking a neutral position, was familiar to me. I only touched on it briefly, in my first response, and then Jenny came back in with a much stronger treatment. I was really glad she did. There were reasons why I didn't wade in right off the bat so I was happy that Jenny took the bull by the horns in a firmer way.
In my opinion, Jenny was absolutely right, that your father's not taking your side was passively abusive. On the face of it, it looks like your dad's just trying to be unbiased. That would seem like a good thing, and in some cases, it might be. Certainly, by claiming to be unbiased, your father presents the image of an impartial judge, a totally fair person. Controlling people often work very hard at presenting a supportive, compassionate front. And that's what it is: a front ---- a facade!
I had it happen to me, in a particular relationship. I was beginning a romantic partnership. Early on and then deeper in, this person insisted on remaining neutral, but then even subtley moving over to the side of a family member who was consistently abusive. In fact, further into the relationship, this person seemed to always take the side of whomever was opposing me! Talk about not being supportive!!!!
Thank you, Jenny, for picking up on that point and opening a dialogue around it.
And thank you, CreativeWoman, for taking time to talk about your story. Absolutely ---- we welcome any further tales you want to talk about. It's really a win/win. Writing about it will help you, and will also help others see that they're not out there dealing with uniquely bizarre behaviors. Most of the things any one of us might share would probably be echoed with only small variations, by thousands of others.
Please take care, be well and keep writing.
Ilene
Embrace non-violence.
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IleneW
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- Joined: Thu 19 Oct, 2006 12:16 pm
my info...
by CreativeWoman on Wed 27 Feb, 2008 12:57 am
Ah yes, I forgot to "introduce" myself, lol. I just turned 33, and my husband and I have been married for 9 years. I'm a stay-home-mommy of 2 young kids; my son is almost 6 and my daughter just turned 4 last week. Completing the family are 2 cats, a betta fish and a field mouse 
When we got married we moved to NC and lived there a few years. (loved it!) When our son was 1 we moved back up to CT.
My circle name suits me well--I love doing lots of creative, artsy stuff. Sewing, drawing, flower arranging, cake decorating, wood carving, making jewelry, etc. I love music...listening to it, that is! I love to sing along. And I love swimming, sailing and just about anything on or in the water. Animals are a big passion of mine, and I've rescued, hand-raised, and found homes for many animals...they add so much joy to my life.
I grew up in CT, with my parents and one brother (7 years older) and one sister (5 years older), so I'm the youngest. I've always been pretty close with my parents. We experienced some verbal abuse from my dad, which I think is due to his emotional immaturity with relating to people, but overall I always thought the atmosphere in our home was loving. I am definitely open to exploring how my family experience affected me, and how I became who I am. I don't want to blame or excuse...just recognizing and understanding how my garden (I love the garden analogy, btw!) was/is what it is would be very insightful, and I'd like to try to make sense of it all.
2 months ago, this past December, was when I first recognized that my husband was actually verbally/emotionally abusive. So dealing with this and begining the healing process is actually quite new to me. I'm trying to learn as much as I can and change what I'm capable of changing. In December as I told my own Psychologist (I have a history of depression) about several events that had recently happened between my husband and me, he was the one to recognize it as verbal/emotional abuse. That's the first time I ever knew why the marriage has felt so confusing, lonely, and scary for me for so long.
There were some clues early on in marriage that my husband was an immature, self-centered man. He was never a "horrible monster," lol, but I thought at times he seemed like an overgrown teenager--which I thought he'd grow out of. Still waiting on that! We've done marriage counseling several times over the years, but what those counselors encouraged was for me as the wife to submit to him. The picture of a marriage with the husband and wife submitting to one another and looking after each others' needs is beautiful, and I'd love to have that kind of marriage...but considering he was already abusive then (and none of those counselors noticed it) that perspective didn't work.
We're currently in marriage counseling, and slowly some things are changing for the better. I'm not sure what will ultimately be the result, but I'm trying very hard to be patient and learn all I can. Our counselor is a great person in general, and very good at relating to us both; my husband and I both like him a lot and I'm very happy to have found a counselor I am comfortable trusting in. Sometimes I worry, though, that the situation of "couples" counseling itself might minimize my husband's responsibility for his abusive behavior...but then just yesterday our counselor encouraged my husband to admit that he has done abusive things...so that's a good start, I think.
Well I've rambled on for a long time here, hehehehe, so I'd better get going to sleep now--it's 1 am! Just wanted to introduce myself a bit, and I hope I answered some of your questions, Jenny.
Thanks so much again for all your input and ideas, Jenny and Ilene. I'm encouraged to see how much you've healed from your own experience, and thankful for your encouragement to me.
When we got married we moved to NC and lived there a few years. (loved it!) When our son was 1 we moved back up to CT.
My circle name suits me well--I love doing lots of creative, artsy stuff. Sewing, drawing, flower arranging, cake decorating, wood carving, making jewelry, etc. I love music...listening to it, that is! I love to sing along. And I love swimming, sailing and just about anything on or in the water. Animals are a big passion of mine, and I've rescued, hand-raised, and found homes for many animals...they add so much joy to my life.
I grew up in CT, with my parents and one brother (7 years older) and one sister (5 years older), so I'm the youngest. I've always been pretty close with my parents. We experienced some verbal abuse from my dad, which I think is due to his emotional immaturity with relating to people, but overall I always thought the atmosphere in our home was loving. I am definitely open to exploring how my family experience affected me, and how I became who I am. I don't want to blame or excuse...just recognizing and understanding how my garden (I love the garden analogy, btw!) was/is what it is would be very insightful, and I'd like to try to make sense of it all.
2 months ago, this past December, was when I first recognized that my husband was actually verbally/emotionally abusive. So dealing with this and begining the healing process is actually quite new to me. I'm trying to learn as much as I can and change what I'm capable of changing. In December as I told my own Psychologist (I have a history of depression) about several events that had recently happened between my husband and me, he was the one to recognize it as verbal/emotional abuse. That's the first time I ever knew why the marriage has felt so confusing, lonely, and scary for me for so long.
There were some clues early on in marriage that my husband was an immature, self-centered man. He was never a "horrible monster," lol, but I thought at times he seemed like an overgrown teenager--which I thought he'd grow out of. Still waiting on that! We've done marriage counseling several times over the years, but what those counselors encouraged was for me as the wife to submit to him. The picture of a marriage with the husband and wife submitting to one another and looking after each others' needs is beautiful, and I'd love to have that kind of marriage...but considering he was already abusive then (and none of those counselors noticed it) that perspective didn't work.
We're currently in marriage counseling, and slowly some things are changing for the better. I'm not sure what will ultimately be the result, but I'm trying very hard to be patient and learn all I can. Our counselor is a great person in general, and very good at relating to us both; my husband and I both like him a lot and I'm very happy to have found a counselor I am comfortable trusting in. Sometimes I worry, though, that the situation of "couples" counseling itself might minimize my husband's responsibility for his abusive behavior...but then just yesterday our counselor encouraged my husband to admit that he has done abusive things...so that's a good start, I think.
Well I've rambled on for a long time here, hehehehe, so I'd better get going to sleep now--it's 1 am! Just wanted to introduce myself a bit, and I hope I answered some of your questions, Jenny.
Thanks so much again for all your input and ideas, Jenny and Ilene. I'm encouraged to see how much you've healed from your own experience, and thankful for your encouragement to me.
Jesus replied, "Things that are impossible with people are possible with God." Luke 18:27
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CreativeWoman
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new stuff
by CreativeWoman on Mon 10 Mar, 2008 2:42 pm
Hi everyone,
I was in the hospital last week, and now I'm home. I missed the forum when I was away! It was colitis that I had...first time I've ever had it. I'm home now and recovering, although I have a horrendously itchy rash all over from a medication allergic reaction from something I had a week ago. *itching!*
Last night I typed some things up to get it off my chest. I typed it for me, but I thought maybe it would be good to share it here:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I had just mentioned the other day how Art was being supportive this past week, really rising to the challenge… he did some great things. He took care of the kids when I went to the ER last Friday, and assisted with them all afternoon once I returned home. Next day, he helped with the kids in the morning and then when I had to go to the ER that afternoon. He attempted to dissuade me from going the second time (didn’t want to pay 2 co-pays) but I went anyway when I determined that I needed to. I was surprised he was acting somewhat caring and compassionate…it is relatively new.
Late Thursday night into Friday morning, he threw up 2 times. In the morning I threw up several times, unexpectedly. I didn’t tell Art when he came in the bathroom shortly after. (In the past, he has frequently gotten angry if I also got whatever illness he was suffering from, saying I “stole it.â€
I was in the hospital last week, and now I'm home. I missed the forum when I was away! It was colitis that I had...first time I've ever had it. I'm home now and recovering, although I have a horrendously itchy rash all over from a medication allergic reaction from something I had a week ago. *itching!*
Last night I typed some things up to get it off my chest. I typed it for me, but I thought maybe it would be good to share it here:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I had just mentioned the other day how Art was being supportive this past week, really rising to the challenge… he did some great things. He took care of the kids when I went to the ER last Friday, and assisted with them all afternoon once I returned home. Next day, he helped with the kids in the morning and then when I had to go to the ER that afternoon. He attempted to dissuade me from going the second time (didn’t want to pay 2 co-pays) but I went anyway when I determined that I needed to. I was surprised he was acting somewhat caring and compassionate…it is relatively new.
Late Thursday night into Friday morning, he threw up 2 times. In the morning I threw up several times, unexpectedly. I didn’t tell Art when he came in the bathroom shortly after. (In the past, he has frequently gotten angry if I also got whatever illness he was suffering from, saying I “stole it.â€
Jesus replied, "Things that are impossible with people are possible with God." Luke 18:27
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CreativeWoman
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Welcome back
by IleneW on Mon 10 Mar, 2008 3:30 pm
Hello CreativeWoman ---
I just read your post and I have many thoughts. I'm on the run right this minute, and will be writing more later, or tomorrow.
My gosh. Your post was so articulate and so gut-wrenching ---- literally!!!!!
What you said at the end, that your partner seems like a lot of work, and all you're getting from it is sick? Well Sister. You said it.
Before I go for now, let me ask you something. The issue about the fifty dollar co-pay for the most recent ER admission . . . . . well let's see. . . . :
fifty dollars? my wife's well-being? fifty dollars? my wife's health and longevity?
Please be very clear, CreativeWoman. This is not about money!
I've got to run, right now. I'll be back with more thoughts, later.
Ilene
I just read your post and I have many thoughts. I'm on the run right this minute, and will be writing more later, or tomorrow.
My gosh. Your post was so articulate and so gut-wrenching ---- literally!!!!!
What you said at the end, that your partner seems like a lot of work, and all you're getting from it is sick? Well Sister. You said it.
Before I go for now, let me ask you something. The issue about the fifty dollar co-pay for the most recent ER admission . . . . . well let's see. . . . :
fifty dollars? my wife's well-being? fifty dollars? my wife's health and longevity?
Please be very clear, CreativeWoman. This is not about money!
I've got to run, right now. I'll be back with more thoughts, later.
Ilene
Embrace non-violence.
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IleneW
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reply
by CreativeWoman on Tue 11 Mar, 2008 1:40 am
Thank you Ilene for your reply. I'm looking forward to hearing your thoughts on this. I feel a bit confused as to why things are going this way with my husband.
Perhaps I've been clueless...if it's not the worry about money, what is it?
I wrote up more about today; I'll post it next...
Perhaps I've been clueless...if it's not the worry about money, what is it?
I wrote up more about today; I'll post it next...
Jesus replied, "Things that are impossible with people are possible with God." Luke 18:27
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CreativeWoman
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My journaling today
by CreativeWoman on Tue 11 Mar, 2008 1:45 am
March 10, 2008
Tonight I felt nauseated and my stomach hurt/burned quite a bit. I felt very sleepy due to the Benadryl and everything going on, so I rested for a bit on my bed. Around 10pm, Art came in and turned on the TV as he sat down on the bed. He acted quite distressed when he saw me there, spacing out, tired and nauseated. He was angry with me for not feeling well. He asked me several times, “why do you keep getting so sick all the time?â€
Tonight I felt nauseated and my stomach hurt/burned quite a bit. I felt very sleepy due to the Benadryl and everything going on, so I rested for a bit on my bed. Around 10pm, Art came in and turned on the TV as he sat down on the bed. He acted quite distressed when he saw me there, spacing out, tired and nauseated. He was angry with me for not feeling well. He asked me several times, “why do you keep getting so sick all the time?â€
Jesus replied, "Things that are impossible with people are possible with God." Luke 18:27
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CreativeWoman
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A start
by IleneW on Tue 11 Mar, 2008 2:05 pm
Hello CreativeWoman ----
Before I attempted to address your many points, I went back and reread this thread and your posts, from the beginning. When I end this post, I'll only be partially through what I have to say. So continue checking for more.
Also before I wade in, I want to tell you, CreativeWoman, that you express yourself and your situation with heartbreaking clarity.
I'm glad you found a counselor who pegged at least part of the situation correctly. You are in an emotionally abusive relationship. And let me add at this point, that couples counseling doesn't necessarily do the victim in an emotionally abusive relationship any good. Sometimes it does her/him more harm than good.
Now --- a question: CreativeWoman ---- have you done any reading or have any familiarity with the topic of nacissistic personalities? If not, we have a thread or two on narcissism. One of those threads is "How Do I Abuse Thee?" There are some more recent ones, also.
See if you see any similarities in what you learn, between the narcissistic profile and your husband's characteristic behavior.
The reason that came to mind is that more than once, you used the terms self-centered and bitterly jealous. Those are pretty good indicators of narcissism.
On to your confusion about how it can be that, your husband's concern with a co-pay to the ER isn't about money:
Look at it this way ---- When you're a parent and your child's at risk for illness, injury or death, what it costs is what it costs. If you have to charge it, you charge it, knowing you'll ultimately pay that fee even if you have to tighten your belt elsewhere. There's no question.
And similarly, within a marriage that's connected at the heart and soul level, and with a minimum of dysfunction, the same would apply. A co-pay of fifty dollars is relatively affordable, and the health and longevity of the person you love is the bottom-line. We're not talking about a luxury item, here.
So --- when a life partner is opposed to following the doctor's directive to check his wife into the ER, the issue is WAY DEEPER than money. The issue is about concern for you health and longevity. If he doesn't care about that, how can he claim to care about You?????
And by the way, the remarks he made about you being a burden because maybe you're sickly????? Even if you were, did he or did he not stand at the alter and promise to you, God and witnesses, that he's committed to you in sickness and in health???????????????
With apologies, I have to end here for now. I will be back. There are so many points I want to address. Stay tuned. . . . .
IW
Before I attempted to address your many points, I went back and reread this thread and your posts, from the beginning. When I end this post, I'll only be partially through what I have to say. So continue checking for more.
Also before I wade in, I want to tell you, CreativeWoman, that you express yourself and your situation with heartbreaking clarity.
I'm glad you found a counselor who pegged at least part of the situation correctly. You are in an emotionally abusive relationship. And let me add at this point, that couples counseling doesn't necessarily do the victim in an emotionally abusive relationship any good. Sometimes it does her/him more harm than good.
Now --- a question: CreativeWoman ---- have you done any reading or have any familiarity with the topic of nacissistic personalities? If not, we have a thread or two on narcissism. One of those threads is "How Do I Abuse Thee?" There are some more recent ones, also.
See if you see any similarities in what you learn, between the narcissistic profile and your husband's characteristic behavior.
The reason that came to mind is that more than once, you used the terms self-centered and bitterly jealous. Those are pretty good indicators of narcissism.
On to your confusion about how it can be that, your husband's concern with a co-pay to the ER isn't about money:
Look at it this way ---- When you're a parent and your child's at risk for illness, injury or death, what it costs is what it costs. If you have to charge it, you charge it, knowing you'll ultimately pay that fee even if you have to tighten your belt elsewhere. There's no question.
And similarly, within a marriage that's connected at the heart and soul level, and with a minimum of dysfunction, the same would apply. A co-pay of fifty dollars is relatively affordable, and the health and longevity of the person you love is the bottom-line. We're not talking about a luxury item, here.
So --- when a life partner is opposed to following the doctor's directive to check his wife into the ER, the issue is WAY DEEPER than money. The issue is about concern for you health and longevity. If he doesn't care about that, how can he claim to care about You?????
And by the way, the remarks he made about you being a burden because maybe you're sickly????? Even if you were, did he or did he not stand at the alter and promise to you, God and witnesses, that he's committed to you in sickness and in health???????????????
With apologies, I have to end here for now. I will be back. There are so many points I want to address. Stay tuned. . . . .
IW
Embrace non-violence.
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IleneW
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